Post by Prolapsed Wrecked 'em on Aug 4, 2009 17:30:29 GMT -5
fuck this, I'm going back to HHH for a minute. Dude has made more careers than anyone I can think of.
The Rock
Cena
Orton
Batista
Kurt Angle (The Stephanie Love Triangle made him)
Road Dogg (tell me what he was doing BEFORE DX. I dare you)
Billy Gunn (tell me what HE was doing before DX. Mr. Ass was his most over)
Sean Waltman (he gave that guy 8 years on his career he never deserved)
Chyna (what the fuck would she be doing without DX?)
Marc Mero (before he got Sable at his side and had that fued with HHH/Perfect... what was he worth?)
On top of that, everyone forgot about Shawn Michaels until he came back to face HHH at Summerslam in that "unsanctioned" match. The two put on one hell of a show and the feud between the two made HBK relevant again. So, you can say he made the HBK Renaissance.
Who else... in the history of wrestling... has made THAT many careers? Even Hogan, Rock, Austin and Taker can't say that.
No one answered Lance Storm way back there from what I saw (perhaps I missed it skipping past Joe's War & Peace-sized blowjob piece on Trips.)
Lance Storm's in-ring ability gets a 9 in my book. The guy had some hops in the few times he did anything aerial. Go watch some of his ECW shit when he had the rat tail, he could keep up with anyone. For gimmick, I say about a 7. Personally, I thought he was really good with what he did, I marked out big time for the "....if I could be serious for a moment...." line. Overall, I think he's way underrated, admittedly he's a bit one-dimensional, but still that one dimension was pretty damned good.
Also, I believe before DX, the Road Dogg was a "roadie" for Jeff Jarrett. I could be mistaken, though.
Here's my reply to Joe on Triple H before I do anything else...
First of all, are we forgetting pro wrestling is fixed? Anyone can win anything in pro wrestling! Case in point – David Arquette.
And now I think you're giving H way too much credit. Giving someone a rub is one thing but 'making' them? I seriously doubt Triple H MADE any of these people and I believe the majority would've reached the top without Triple H. Hell, they might've been better off without Triple H.
Yeah, he's been there a long time and he's done a lot in his career but that doesn't give him an automatic 10.
I think my rating was fair!
As for the HIAC match, that was always going to be a love/hate thing, along with Triple H.
As far as a wrestling match goes, it was pretty simple but it was one hell of a spectacle. And if we want to get technical... technically, Foley's 2 bumps occurred before the match even began. LOL
I always thought Kane was overrated. I liked him as a monster, that's about it.
Oh yeah, Corino was awesome and his feud with Homicide in ROH rocked. When Homicide killed Corino's hearing in one ear.
Someone rate Tajiri and give me another Japanese wrestler. I know a lot of 'em but I can't rate Tajiri fairly having only seen him WWE and once or twice in HUSTLE.
Yeah, I'm kinda new to pro wrestling compared to a lot of people in my age group. I only started watching on a regular basis at the very end of 1999.
And there's so much damn wrestling in the world that it's impossible to watch it all.
There's a lot of ECW I want to see but right now I'm trying to watch Pro Wrestling NOAH, ROH, old and new AJPW, old and new NJPW, HUSTLE, DDT and so on! There's way too much.
Post by Prolapsed Wrecked 'em on Aug 5, 2009 18:44:04 GMT -5
Tajiri in ECW was a solid 8. Him and Mikey Whipwreck with the Sinister Minister, as said earlier, were a great tag team.
Tajiri in WWE was just sad. They made him Regal's bitch first and that pissed me off more than anything else.
Put him with Torrie Wilson for no goddamn reason and it was never explained why she was even interested in him.
They had him turning heel and face more times than anyone I can remember during the, what, like 3 years he was in the E?
They stereotyped him with Akio and Sakoda in whatever the hell that Japanese Yakuza group was. Shit, Akio is the only one left there as Jimmy Wang Yang, which is a sad SAD gimmick in itself.
And I didn't get to see his on screen presence much in WCW. How long did that last anyway?
As far as a booker goes, I'm kinda mixed. As much as people hate him, he came to fame as head booker of WWF's boom period in the 90's so he deserves some credit. On the flip side, he had Vince McMahon above him and talent like Rock, Stone Cold, Taker and Foley under him... talent that would probably draw no matter who was booking back then.
He's always been a crash TV style booker... Quick and surprising, exciting and extreme and as a PRO WRESTLING fan now, I don't appreciate that style as much as I did back then.
A lot of people blame for the downfall of WCW but I wasn't there and I don't know what happened. Vince Russo is adamant that the ratings increased while he was there... and that he was only booking for 3 months before he was removed from power.
Now I've witnessed a distinct change in direction for TNA since Russo became booker again in 2006, was it? Or 2007... and I don't like it! But Russo's always said, his job is to get ratings and that's all. He doesn't care about smarks like me and you and he's clearly not promoting PRO WRESTLING. Well that TNA slogan didn't last long did it... 'We Are Wrestling'.
As far as a booker goes... well he only knows how to book one way but that's probably true of most bookers. So can I fault him on that? I don't know...
He does seem 2 go wild without Vince McMahon reigning him in. If he was in charge of his own promotion, I'd like to see how long it would last.
And overall, I think he's done a lot to hurt professional wrestling since he's been involved.
Post by Moss Works Jericho's Schedule on Aug 5, 2009 22:30:20 GMT -5
The Brain is a legend, my friend, a legend.
As a manager, 9. He was just about the greatest manager ever, only slightly less (my opinion of course) than Jim Cornette. He was the perfectly cowardly, "weaselly" manager, who seemed to have a never-ending supply of schemes and back up plans. I only rank him at 9 because I want to save the 10 for...
As an announcer, 10! Bobby the Brain is THE best announcer in history. No one was more entertaining, week in and week out, no one had better chemistry than Heenan and Monsoon, no one had as many great one-liners and no one introduced as many cliches to the game. It's a shame his cancer affected his voice
Post by Prolapsed Wrecked 'em on Aug 5, 2009 22:48:05 GMT -5
Bobby "The Weasel" Heenan... one of, and quite possibly THE greatest manager in this history of professional wrestling. Just as a quick list, here's who he's managed and with them, the titles they won while Heenan was in their corner:
Nick Bockwinkel - AWA World Championship, AWA Tag Team Championship Ray Stevens - AWA Tag Team Chamiponship Bobby Duncum Sr. - AWA Tag Team Championship Blackjack Lanza - AWA Tag Team Championship
(Heenan was the first manager to have both the AWA World Champion and AWA Tag Team Champion in his stable. This was the first incarnation of the Heenan Family)
Andre The Giant - WWF Championship, WWF Tag Team Championship Rick Rude - WWF Intercontinental Championship Arn Anderson - WWF Tag Team Championship Tully Blanchard - WWF Tag Team Championship Haku - WWF Tag Team Championship Mr. Perfect - WWF Intercontinental Championship (twice)
Heenan then went on to become a "broadcast journalist" which, honestly, was one of the greatest things they ever did. Heenan as a commentator was simply priceless being right alongside great straight-man Gorilla Monsoon. Monsoon and Heenan had a great chemistry. He didn't ONLY do the TV though. Heenan introduced two HUGE WWF signings:
"The REAL World's Champion" Ric Flair "The Narcissist" Lex Luger
Heenanisms: "Humanoids" "Ham-and-eggers" and those long-winded rants about heel wrestlers leaving Gorilla to utter his line "WILL YOU STOP"
Heenan then went to WCW to do Nitro and Thunder. Although, sadly, WCW never appreciated how great Heenan was as a commentator. They replaced him with fucking MARK MADDEN on Nitro for Christ's sake, then replaced him on Thunder with Stevie Fucking Ray.
The man's overcome throat cancer and has very little of a tongue left. How sad. The one thing that gained him the notoriety and the fame is the one thing that has truly failed him after all this time.
More Heenan Family Members before my final grade:
Adrian Adonis Ken Patera King Kong Bundy Big John Studd Paul Orndorff Harley Race Hercules Hernandez The Barbarian Ted DiBiase Brooklyn Brawler Nikolai Volkoff Ernie Ladd
Heenan's the best at what he did. The Weasel would cause riots if he were in his prime today.
Post by Moss Works Jericho's Schedule on Aug 5, 2009 23:40:21 GMT -5
Hennig was of course, perfect. 10 for technical skill and match ability. 7 for charisma and promo ability, I remember him being a good talker but not like one of the gods.
Post by Prolapsed Wrecked 'em on Aug 6, 2009 0:12:13 GMT -5
most... underrated... villain... EVER.
His million dollar corporation was something people HATED during it's heyday. IRS, Bam Bam, 123 Kid, Bundy, Sid, Nikolai Volkoff, and Tatanka. What a group.
As a wrestler, he was awesome, probably an 8.5 As a promo, he was also rather good, but not nearly Jake the Snake or The Rock. so, I'll go with a 7.
Also had quite the hand in creating Stone Cold Steve Austin, now didn't he?